Feels like I’m comprehensively winning this
https://x.com/chrisrugaber/status/1775899813059362960?s=46&t=N0_fcOKIYYmlCS2e4YShsQ
Daily drumbeat of the news plus grocery prices.
Poll: 43% of swing state voters say their state economy is “not so good/poor” and 63% of them say the national economy is “not so good/poor.”
You: The economy is in fact good, and I feel that I am comprehensively winning this.
I mean, if you want Biden to run on “Fuck the bottom 43% of swing state voters,” that’s one way to go! In fact, it probably leads to you getting a big tax cut from Trump.
30-40% of the country are maga shitheads, which is the main thing that determines how you view the economy.
People in general continue to say that they and their community are doing well, but they think the nation as a whole is doing poorly.
That clearly has nothing to do with the lower class, median incomes and whatever actual reason y’all have tried to explain these numbers with. The fact is that it’s just perception, and you have to fight it
That graph shows like less than 20% of people in swing states say economy is doing well?
ETA (I guess better is different than well)
ETA2 that makes more sense
No, a net 20 point advantage for better over bad, so like a 60-40 split.
I gotcha that makes more sense
In your head, yeah, because you’re not interested in how the economy is actually doing.
Here’s some other results from that same poll, that definitely tell us that everything is awesome:
Only 26% of respondents think that the ability for the average person to get ahead is moving in the right direction! Only 23% of swing state voters think their state’s economy has gotten better than last two years, 44% say worse!
Did you read the whole poll, or just the tweet?
No cw as shown in poll after poll.
Trying to dig in deeper into the crosstabs is you missing the point again. These people think their state is doing well. It has nothing to do with any political idea you have about what should be
Funny how you cited polls while skipping over all the screenshots of the very poll you cited, because they didn’t make your argument. You’re not interested in finding the truth or how the economy is actually doing. You’re interested in claiming victory in arguments and/or not changing anything in this economy because it’s working great for you.
You edited to add this while I was replying:
LOL don’t dig in deeper you might miss the point, surface level only here folks! You know what buddy, you win, I give up. I can’t argue with someone who has no good faith interest in digging deeper than a tweet and a screenshot, who refuses to look at anything that threatens their fragile assumptions.
Because they aren’t relevant. Again, none of the people’s feelings about any of these subjects are more than very loosely tied to reality. Talk about people being mad about inflation or upward mobility nationally all you want, when people are asked about their own community, they think things are going well.
That’s because the media is fucked in this country, not because people feel the national economic angst while thinking things are ok at home.
You fundamentally are vastly overestimating how Americans make their opinions, and the fact is that they are utter morons. They aren’t synthesizing new information and coming to conclusions, they’re watching tv and regurgitating what they see
Gather round, morons, and listen to CaffeineNeeded Joe Biden tell you how good you have it and why everything is going just fine and more of the same is a big win for the middle class! So what if you can’t afford a house or you’re being told to eat cereal for dinner to make ends meet, what are you, one of those morons regurgitating what you see on TV? You know four more years of the same will be awesome! Didn’t you see the Wall Street Journal poll?
What could possibly go wrong?
Never mind your bad faith tactics as usual. Don’t look at crosstabs, they’re not worth discussing! Except the one crosstab I want to discuss!
I’m really done with this, why should I waste my time with someone arguing in bad faith who refuses to look at anything other than tweets that back up his own point of view? All you do is lose arguments ITT, then drive by with a tweet a few days later and refuse to look at any evidence to the contrary, while calling everyone else stupid and getting personally offended if anyone points out that you’re financially biased on the subject.
Anyways this is the best breakdown I’ve seen relevant to this discussion. Unsurprisingly, people who make more money think the economy is doing well, but you basically only see this effect in democrats. The number one thing that determines your view of the economy is your political affiliation.
I think this conversation has kinda lost its purpose. We were talking about if good idea for Biden to walk around just saying “the economy is universally awesome vote for me” as a winning strategy. And pretty much everyone thinks a more nuanced approach of pointing to some strengths, comparing to other places that not doing well and blaming Rs for bad stuff is the way to go and seems that the strategy Biden has taken.
Come on dude. I don’t think your point is relevant to mine. You really, really, really want to have a discussion centered around your political view of the world that says the economy is unfair and that’s why people think the economy is bad. I’m even sympathetic to that view point that the economy is unfair!
That isn’t why people say the economy is bad. It’s not inflation. It’s not inequality. It’s that a massive cult has made any sort of republican think the economy is awful and a media that allows them to treat that narrative as ‘an equal side of the story’.
Once again, handwaves away all arguments on the other side with an, “anyways.” More bad faith. And your point ignores the most obvious part of this ever: why should Joe Biden’s campaign give a fuck what conservatives say in polls/think? They’re always always always voting for Trump.
His job is to convince/turn out the people who might vote for him, and the people who might vote for him are living in reality and notice when the economy sucks for them and when it’s good for them, so walking around telling them how star spangled awesome everything is when the economy is not working for them would be dumb.
Well, not quite everyone, some people want to go with “EVERYTHING IS GREAT!”
It does seem that Biden has pointed to things that need to be better (housing costs for one), and his polling has improved markedly since the SOTU - probably largely because he reminded everyone he has a pulse and active brainwaves, but I think also because he spoke to some of the stuff that matters for the working class.
The only points you’ve thought are relevant in the weeks (months?) we’ve been arguing about this are your own and people who agree with you, and you never look at anything to the contrary - I know this because you’ve never pushed back on any of it, you’ve just handwaved it away over and over.
You: Here’s proof I’m right
Me: Here’s crosstabs from the same poll that contradict you
You: Crosstabs? We can’t be digging down into crosstabs!
Me: Your proof was a crosstab!
You: ANYways!
So why would I waste any more of my time?
BY YOUR OWN EVIDENCE, AGAIN, YOUR OWN EVIDENCE!!! Over half of middle income Dems and nearly 70% of lower income Dems don’t think the economy is good. And you want to campaign on telling these people it’s awesome!
Sympathetic to it
Wants Biden to say he’ll fix it
Gee, I wonder why?
Dude I didn’t even see your post before making that one
I do want Biden to say stuff about how he will improve the economy though? I just don’t want him to allow republicans to frame the entire economy as bad.
Well then I guess you’ve conclusively won the argument by… coming around to the other side.
Or you just lost the plot…